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jessica
Vogue SISter (3047)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 12:53
On school mornings I babysit for a friends child and take him to school with my own children, along with one other child.
The other child is not a friends child but now an associate of mine who pays me on time every week- without me having to ask. She gives me $5 a day.
My friend however does not pay me promptly and usually I have to bring it up in conversation- and once she has even underpaid me. She is supposed to pay me bi-weekly on Wednesdays but she usually does not pay me until I ask her- and usually it's not even on the same day that I ask- which I don't think I should even have to ask- she should just pay me like the other parents do- promptly.
I don't want her to think that I am just doing this more as a favor than to earn extra money- because really I could do without the extra responsibility in the mornings as they are already very busy- and she does not have any other options for childcare either.
I am not sure how to approach her because she is very sensative and tends to take thing sthe wrong way- and I am very non-confrontational- so I need to e gentle about this.
Also- on half days I feel that if I am caring for someone's child while they are working and earning money- I deserve to be paid for my services. Even if I am a good friend to that person. I am not quite sure how to say that without sounding like I am being greedy- but I think it's fair to expect to be paid while the parent is working. I think it s different if single mom friend needs a break and wants to go out on a date or to shop without the child- I am willing to help out like that and I would like the same kind of deal there. But if I were to go to work I would absolutely pay the person who is watching my kids- even if it were a good friend.
So without sounding like all contract-ish and demanding- do you have any ideas you could share with me on how you would talk to your friend about the situation?
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MrsVo
Style Addict (1362)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 13:02
Oh I'm so sorry you are having to deal with this. I wish I had some good idea on how to address it, but I don't :( I am terrible about avoiding conflict. Good luck!!
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tallynt
Style Goddess (7945)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 13:12
Honestly, I really wish I could help you out. My sister did this for awhile and eventually had to stop because her friend continually did this and just put a strain on the relationship.
I have one thought - could you approach it like this - "Could you pay me on X date because I use that money to pay for X and it gets difficult if I don't get paid on time"
And my one other thought - each week look at the school schedule and say to her on Monday - "So Wednesday is a 1/2 day so to verify the hours this week are X to X in the morning and X - X Wednesday afternoon as well, correct?"
More matter of fact and yes businessy but then it doesn't sound too demanding and lets her know you do this not out of the kindness of your heart but as work.
Keep the talk about playdates, helping out, etc like friends so the two sound very different.
Not sure if that helps at all.
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tallynt
Style Goddess (7945)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 13:14
Oh and as a working mom -
If I had a friend taking my son to and from school and watching him, I would expect to pay her just like I pay the nanny on-time and for the hours she watched my child.
If a friend was doing me a favor, picking them up just once or having him over for a play-date then I wouldn't expect to pay her just expect to return the favor one day.
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momof3crazies
Model SISter (2609)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 13:18
Well I am a daycare provider so I have MANY opinions on this and have been thru this a lot in my last 9 years of babysitting!
First things first....you are going to have to tell her...point blak....you have to...otherwise it will eat at you forever and then animosity will build and that is just not fair to you!
You DO DESERVE to get paid! Absolutely! If she was having to take her child to a before and after school program that would probably run her approximately $50 per week...and if she was late in payment or had to be reminded all the time, she would no longer be welcome to bring her child there....see where I am going here??
I babysit on occasion my neice and they ALWAYS pay me....cuz she trusts me with the life of her child and would prefer that she is with me than anyone else! so you are not only doing hera favor, but giving the child the comfort of being somewhere familiar!
As for how you should approach it, just maybe be nice...nicer than ice...talk about how at the end of the month, you need to do your "books" for the month and if she has not paid you in that proper month, your books will be off....kwim?? That would be bringing it up in casual conversation! Otherwise I am with you...it is uncomfortable to ask, but if you worked outside the home at a big company and you went to pick up your check at the end of the work week, and they forgot??? I don't think so....does not happen and if it did happen, it would be a bad thing!
Hang in there girl!!
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lydiajane
Style Goddess (7448)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 13:19
Maybe on the day before she is suppose to pay you, give her a paper invoice for what you are owed--could even tell her it's just so you can keep track and plan you own bills. Such a pickle of a situation! I am sure that she isn't taking advantage of you--probably just absentminded, but she has a good deal with you watching her child and probably would prefer that vs a daycare center where they wouldn't take care of him/her as well as you do, plus charge a whole lot more! It is hard tho, some people think that SAHM's have it so easy and that it's no problem watching more kids since all we do is sleep in and watch tv all day (or scrapbook!) Hope it works out for you! :-)
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StraitFan10
SISter Superior (6289)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 13:19
That is so hard!! I feel for you!! I do daycare in my home, and people still don't pay on time! Hello, this IS my job, I want to be paid on time like you do !! I can only imagine what would happen if they didn't get their paychecks!! (sorry about that rant!)
Why not just bring say that you've decided that the only money your going to spend on scrapbooking stuff is what she pays you! Then tell her that there is a lot of stuff you NEED!! LOL!! Maybe she'll get the hint??
I wish I had a great answer for you, you'd think I was an expert after almost 9 years doing daycare!
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tallynt
Style Goddess (7945)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 13:24
So just one other thought that might help -
Since this is your job, treat it that way to yourself and your friend. Like momof3crazies said. Do your books, run an invoice for the work, etc.
I think sometimes people don't mean to take advantage but since it is handled in a casual way they forget this is your business. You are not a SAHM, you are a daycare provider. Make the lines very distinct.
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kitleen
SISter Superior (6649)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 14:27
okay...but would she need to get a daycare license if she called this a job, had invoices, etc?? I know here in Arizona they have some pretty strict laws on that stuff.
I don't know how this works.
It really stinks you're in this bind, Jessica.
But, you don't want to buy any legal trouble, either!
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kitleen
SISter Superior (6649)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 14:28 - Edited by: kitleen
can you tell what I did before I became a SAHM? ;-)
I was in law.....but I am NOT giving legal advice here. Just asking if that's something you need to consider!!!!
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tallynt
Style Goddess (7945)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 14:58
good point kitleen, didn't even think of that. Not to mention claiming it on your taxes.
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lpmkate
Cruiser Mama
Stylicious SISter (9352)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 15:09
Would it be easier to put it in writing...act like you are doing it for the other woman as well? Make a new "policy" of sorts?
I used to watch a child in my home - a friend's child - but she was awesome about paying me...on time, in cash on the first day of the month for the whole month.
I know it's hard dealing with sensitive people, especially if you have a hard time with confrontation...but you HAVE to do this. She is not being a good friend. It's too bad that you have to confront her in some way, but it needs to be done. She would not be able to do this at a daycare or other childcare service...she's taking advantage of you.
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klamb1970
Fashion Plate (387)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 15:19
It is hard to do, but I think you have to be upfront and honest with her about this. Evenutally it will put a strain on your relationship with her, and I can tell you really value her friendship. She really is the one who has created this situation, and you have to let her know that you cannot be taken advantage of. In the end, if you face her and you are honest about your feelings, you will feel so much better, and so will she. Maybe by talking you will find out the true reason why she is not paying on time and you can work out a better system between the two of you. I know that starting this type of conversation is hard. Good Luck. I am sure it will be fine in the end.
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jessica
Vogue SISter (3047)
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# Posted: 3 Dec 2007 16:09
Thanks for all of your advice.
I am not technically a day care provider. I just take the kids to school- and I would be the back up if and when school is delayed or child is sick and mom can't wake time off.
It is puttin g a strain on things in a way- but I am trying hard to not let it. I don't think the late/short payment is an oversight. I think she took advantage of me. Seriosuly I am not one to say something like that but that is what is making me so upset. This kind of stuff make sme not want to help her out in the mornings anymore because it's a pain when I rely on the money to buy scrap stuff and to treat my kids to take out on the weekends- she does mess up plans. It really aggravates me when I make promises to the kids and the money doesn't get delivered. It's almost like she expects me to nag her and then walk to her house to pick it up!
But I will have to have a talk with her about it. I am just such a big chicken. lol
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scrapprincess2002
Model SISter (2624)
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# Posted: 4 Dec 2007 10:36
well i am bad about not wanting to rock the boat about things or argue so a realoy cool friend told me to make myslef a big not card with all the point i need to make when confronting something that has me upset wow I know it works now I am not nearly as non confritational I have came out of myshell my hubby wants to put me back my sons teacher is kind of scared of me I think hahah so just right it all down and get in front of that bathroom mirror and practice being firm and don't let her run over you girl its you time she is using and your kiddos she is disapointing stay firm and get that off your chest or you will make yourself sick about it!!! GOOD LUCK!!!
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Bernadette
Vogue SISter (3115)
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# Posted: 4 Dec 2007 20:04
Definitely talk to her. I think a lot of it depends on how the arrangement came to be. I think if in the beginning you laid out that you would take her kid to school for x pay and you would take her kid home on your half days for x pay, then it's pretty cut and dry and I like the paper invoice tip (let her know it is to make it easier for her to remember when to pay you and you won't feel uncomfortable having to ask) and having a convo about it.
Not with friends, but my family is notorious for issues with this. Some might think with family it is a given and it depends on who works who doesn't but I would say that none of that matters so much as the expectations you each lay out together.
If your friend is going through you because you're the "lifesaving friend offering her a hand in an extreme time of need" then the conversation is very different than the one you'd have with the acquaintance who expected from day one to always pay you $5 per day.
You didn't mention beyond your friend not having anywhere else to go for child care, but I know I've been in plenty of situations where I lent a hand and actually charged the stay at home mom (with a hubby who was doing VERY well) and DiDn'T charge the working single mom because she couldn't make ends meet as it was. It wasn't a matter of she's working and bringing in money or who deserved to be paid, it was a matter of having an agreement with her that I'd watch her kid on the half day and in exchange, she took care of my sister's son on Saturday mornings when my sister had to go to work.
So yeah if you're not confrontational and she's super sensitive, kinda trying to think back to what the original agreement was and maybe instead talking with her about the bigger picture--how you can both help each other out--be it financially, babysitting, grocery shopping, or otherwise, is the approach to take so you don't feel like you're losing a friend, putting her out there or (very importantly) being taken advantage of.
Good luck with this! I can tell it is hard on you because you truly care about her and WANT to help out, but want to do so within the parameters you thought you had set.
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melisser
Style Maven (699)
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# Posted: 4 Dec 2007 20:20
ugh - what a bummer this has turned into....I know that sometimes some of my friends think we are annoying or whatever but we really do not mix business and friendship - mainly because of situations like this.
Isn't it crazy how money can change the dynamic of a friendship so quickly. I think it is important to be TOTALLY upfront and honest in telling your friend what you expect and why.....maybe she doesn't have the same feeling/idea about money and doesn't realize that you are relying on it?for those special treats?? I know that is a stretch, but just a thought.
Also, if I were in your shoes I would write up a little letter and give it to both parents just setting out your policy. Maybe try having payment in full for two weeks of service paid on friday and if you don't have funds by Sunday at noon then you do not pick up on monday - simple as that - and you can just say "new policy" and things like "trying to make things easier for both of us" blah blah.....Maybe if your friend had actual repercussions for non-payment she would be sure to have payment to you on time.
This is also where you could add the "half-day" or "hourly" rate also to be paid in full by Friday and if that is also not paid then you don't pick up on monday.
Also, I don't charge my friends when I watch their kids, but that is because I know that maybe next month I will need some help and they will be there for me, but that is only for a once in a while situation. If it were a frequent thing I would DEFINATELY expect to be paid.
Good luck with all this - I am sure this is quite a struggle for you. Friends and money are a tough combo to deal with when they don't have the same level of respect that you expect that they should.
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jessica
Vogue SISter (3047)
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# Posted: 5 Dec 2007 13:28 - Edited by: jessica
I figured it all out now so we are all going to 9hopefully) be happy with our situation - on both sides.
I talked with her about that I figured she was probably having a hard time doing this on her own so I asked her if she would like to do a different kind of exchange.
She works right across the street from the school our kids go to so she always picks her son up at the end of the day- so I asked her if she would grab my kids too- and since I have her little guy for over an hour every day and she only has mine for 10 minutes- to make it an even exchange, if she could help me out (cause I'm a bad winter driver, scared to death and she's not) to give my dd a ride to dance on mondays- and we can take the boys out for an hour to do something little with them.
She loved the idea- and I think this is going to work out.
Money is definitely not the issue- the friendship is, of course, way more important to me than having a bit of extra money and the original agreement probably was good back in september when we made the arrangements- but ya know, every agreement needs revising. Situations change- and friends need to be happy together.
thanks for the advice. I was able to deal with this in a creative way- and not have to make her or me uncomfortable.
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camport
Style Addict (1206)
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# Posted: 5 Dec 2007 15:07
I have BEEN THERE! I didn't read through all the other responses, but here's mine and I hope I'm not repeating what someone else said.
My best friend of 12 years did the same thing to me! She was stuck and needed a sitter and agreed on like $80 a week. Both of our sons were 8 months old. I thought it would be fun and I could earn some money. Our kids would entertain each other, right?
WRONG! Her kid cried every single day for an entire college semester. 5 hours a day+. My gosh, I did not like that kid after about a week. It put a huge strain on our relationship. She paid me on time for the most part, but there were weeks that she was late or wanted a discount if she picked him up early. Which was fine BUT there were days that she didn't have school and would drop him off to go shopping. She didn't tell me until she picked him up that she didn't have school that day.
After Christmas break, she asked if I was still up to it. I told her I'd help her find a good day care.
With Christmas break coming up, it would be a great opportunity for you to make a change! Either tell her you'll need her to start paying you at the beginning of the week and set a permanant price or tell her you just aren't going to be able to do it anymore. I am completely non confrontational too, so I know how you feel.
If nothing else, blame it on your husband!!
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camport
Style Addict (1206)
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# Posted: 5 Dec 2007 16:12
aaaand I see that you already resolved the situation and feel like a big dork now for my input.
:)
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jessica
Vogue SISter (3047)
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# Posted: 5 Dec 2007 16:54
o no! It's relieving to know that I am not the only one who has had to deal with this stuff- from the looks of it, it's too bad this is so common!
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